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Client Hate

Last post 31 Aug 2007 by

james

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james

Not client hate per se, but what happens when you're stuck in a position where you have to use a certain element in your piece that has already been poorly created for you? Does it truly take a really creative person to utilize that element to the best of his/her ability, or is it a futile attempt at all that will bring down the quality of the rest of the site?

The problem is that I have a problem with my client who has gone and made a logo y himself and wants me to use it in the website I'm creating for him. I asked to redo it, but he has already tattooed it on all his company trucks. So what do I do? I thought Id'd bring it up as a methodical question like meredith's. ;)

Reply 21 Aug 2007

edhall

Deal with it and try to present the logo in the best manner that you can. There will always be times when you will receive less than perfect resources from the client. Who insist that this is the route that they want to go. You have 3 options to go with this.

1. Do what the client says.
2. Do what the client says but try to be creative about it.
3. Do what the client says, but also present to them how you would have done the design as well.

The 3rd option sometimes works it shows the client how their proposed ideas where not very good. But you deliver to them something much better. Downfall, you run the risk that the client still may not want that and lose the time for the work.

You should aim to please the client. But you should also go over and beyond what the client expects. You never know if your concepts for the logo is really good he could be convinced to change his logo. Be a salesman as well as a designer.
----
Ed
i design things.

Quote 21 Aug 2007

james

Wow, great ideas dude. I'll really keep that in mind and likely do as you say. Never really thought of it from that angle. :)

Quote 21 Aug 2007

fleshylimblessspectacle

i am with ed but you could secretly hate them too.
Because you know they are going to pick the one design you do not like or did as a "ugly backup".
----
Bless,
fleshy limbless spectacle (Trece.)

Quote 21 Aug 2007

carly

All above comments agreed.

It generally depends on the type of client you have. I've had a few clients with the "my niece made this logo for me" type scenario, you mostly just have to accept that even though you think it's ugly...they love it! The bigger the client the more likely they will listen to your ideas that you don't think the logo works very well. Like edhall says, you need to give them a strong enough argument as to why you think it doesn't work, and why you think something else will. It all depends whether it is worth it or not.

I had a lecturer in college that in response to the "why do clients always pick the design I don't like?" said, "I never present to the client anything that I don't like...that way they're always going to pick something that I love".

I find that the smaller the client, the more subjective they are with the stuff you give them. But it does depend how much you can sell your idea.

A lot of the time you just have to grin and bear it. You just have to remember that different people like different things. You'll probably end up making something that you hate but the client loves. It doesn't mean you have to go and put it in your portfolio for everyone to see does it?

Quote 21 Aug 2007

meredith

This concept here is one that has always been the fine line for me between art vs design.

James, i have been in your topic situation for over a year now with my full time mon-fri slave job. Coupled with logistics coordination & brokerage slash customer call center for clients, vendors, & brokers, i have had the additional hat of "Company Designer who gets paid logistics coordinator salary"

My company had our outsourced IT Dept (who handles everything down to day to day problems with our server) freelance out an asp programmer to code the backend portion of our website, merging our site with the companies data base (ms access). I got the job of creating all of the pages which had not yet been created, and go into the current asp files and edit the html to match the new layout - Design the enduser portion of the site, for clients and their vendors.. and the worst task of all....

Creating business cards with their stupid ass ugly logo, that someone else made ( i think our IT Dept freelanced that one out again ). The logo is So ugly, it doesnt matter what i do to it or with it, the idea is lame but i also understand in some industries its good to dumb things down a bit... and thats fine.

But to get back to my point.. it really does present a challenge to your artistic side to have to meet these sort of demands, so you can choose to back down, or you can step up to it.

I look at it like this.. i could do something i hate doing every day for the rest of my life. Or i could do something that i love doing every day of my life, and sometimes don't necessarily like the "content" - You're Still Doing What You Love! :]

Quote 21 Aug 2007

fleshylimblessspectacle

@ carly:

why do clients always pick the design I don't like?" said, "I never present to the client anything that I don't like...that way they're always going to pick something that I love".

Have found that to be impossible, as hard as not to laugh at the winnebago man. seriously.
They will somehow pick the one you like the least of the ones you love. I reckon it is a cosmic law or some shit like that.
----
Bless,
fleshy limbless spectacle (Trece.)

Quote 21 Aug 2007

edhall

Yeah oddly they do that, but every so often a glitch in the cosmic law happens and they pick the one you want them to.

I wonder if you can somehow put subliminal messaging into your designs so clients always pick the one you want them to. HAAHAHA
----
Ed
i design things.

Quote 21 Aug 2007

carly

Fleshy; as much as I hate to admit it, I think this comes down to in a way that we design stuff that we like...not necessarily what is good for the client! If the exact model of yourself is not the target market for your clients product, then it can be extremely difficult imagining what they want.

Having said that....if your clients aren't a target market of their product either...this can be even trickier ;)

Quote 21 Aug 2007

fleshylimblessspectacle

@ ed: ahhh yes, tried it and i am sad to report it did not work... maybe my subliminal message was just too wimpy. damnit!

@ carly: i have done just that quite a couple of times [design to please myself], but i do swear on the winnebago man that as my duty as a graphic designer, i also research and try to know as much as i can about the target audience/demographics etc before presenting a design. And then... cosmic law hits right in between the eyes.
What gives?
----
Bless,
fleshy limbless spectacle (Trece.)

Quote 21 Aug 2007

luisaraujo

there are things we do because we want to
and
there are things because we think we have to
----
"He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."

Quote 21 Aug 2007

carly

fleshy; I still think...no matter how much you try put yourself in the mind of a 92year old man to think of something they would like...you're still not actually a 92year old man ;)

Quote 22 Aug 2007

james

@ fleshylimblessspectacle: I do. But it's so sad because I know they're trying to be nice (and so am I ;P).

To your second comment why ont make your worst your best? I never give a client something I really don't feel fit whether I've put the hours into it or not. Like my girlfriend's dad does with his art and music, never throw things out. My desktop has endless .PSDs that haven't been touched with Notepad yet but I keep them so that if I need something to use I have something to work off of.

To the third: Yeah, I always try to keep in mind what my client wants it's clients to see, and what they want them to think, and for the general browser to think and to know once they click onto their site.

@ carly: Great points. I always usually have a couple of designs for clients to see and choose and I hate when they don't like something I love but I have to realize, okay they have a different taste and I ask them what they don't like about it. Now I've started asking clients beforehand to give me 5 random websites they think are super awesome cool and I judge form that their likes and dislikes.

To the second comment: yeah, it's sometimes hard to design to the company's market niche or market in general. I did a bead site and had trouble making it look the way that I wanted but keeping the professional element. Some javascript and a few photos later and I feel great about it.

To the third: hahaha yeah but you can sure as hell try. I feel old doing the stuff I do every day but I'm still a 16 year-old when it comes down to it and I can't do everything. Hard to come to terms with that sometimes.

@ meredith: Yeah! But the thing is when you use that ugly-ass logo you look like an idiot having your name attached to it. Like carly said, you don't have to put it in your portfolio or anything but you kind of feel weird putting something ugly out there and you always wonder if you could have done better.

@ edhall: Watermarks? :P

@ luis: Oh God... not one of these again. lol.

Quote 22 Aug 2007

meredith

what i hate is that, i spend time on something that is just going to no longer exist to me. i guess that comes with the whole package deal. i think the vast majority of people in this industry are aware that our names will be attached to things we don't necessarily like. they are aware because this issue is hugely common. and i agree you do wonder often had your interest perspective adjusted slightly, what more you could've done. It helps me to have an open angle view at all times and go with the flow.

Quote 22 Aug 2007

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